The lamp ...

[RSStory]

Originally Posted by r_fredrick_smith

A lot of what you say is true. But often we have to react based on our long term experience with comments. Its a lot easier in person when you can interact and see the persons face and demeanor and know whether they're really dead serious or not or just having fun themselves. That's one of the reasons we have the emoticons. I try to watch for them. If someone has an emoticon attached to a remark about getting a headache looking at my work then I tend to treat it a a fun thing. If the emoticon is not there then I guess I tend to suspect the worst. I personally think one should never make remarks in a critique that could be construed as "hurtful" when made in a medium like a forum. Why do we need to make statements like that? Does it help the conversation? Does it make the recipient feel better about his work and accept any criticisms made or does it tend to "turn them off" and make them retire from the conversation. I know from experience that is does do that. I have gotten pms on this forum and others about the kinds of comments that can have this kind of effect. I've seen people just stop participating over things like this. That's why I like to talk them out when they first start occurring with the hopes that they'll not be a regular part of our conversations.

So what should a photo critique do? How should it be worded. I think we should be specific if possible. Say what we think is wrong. Never use words like "terrible" or "awful" or things like that. The work may be terrible, but that doesn't really help the person getting the critique. So instead we find words that tone down the expression. So which is better. The "lighting is terrible" or "lighting needs work" and then offer a specific suggestion on how to improve the lighting. Apply the golden rule when writing critiques. Make them helpful and not hurtful.

I know this has turned into a "rant" of sorts, but since you raised a very valid point, I thought it should be dealt with in some depth and it is probably worthy of a separate thread at some time that might be called the "art of critiques" or something like that.

Cheers,
rfs

when I give a critique I say exactly what I would say in person and in exactly the same tone. I am brutally honest when it comes to my opinions on images just as many have been with me in the past. I have had many great photographers look at my work and just shred it brutally. I respect them because they didnt sugarcote things. If they thought is sucked then that is what I expect to hear. I am getting tired of political correctness and oh, that will hurt their self esteem or whatever... Self Esteem, the keyword is self. I am not responsible for that. People need to look inside themselves and decide if they can handle the truth from other people or not. The lighting sucks or the lighting needs work???? Either way it means the same thing. If it sucks then it sucks, now tell me why it sucks and how I can make it not suck.
When I rip a shot apart, in most cases it isnt personal against the shooter. (although I have been known to rip apart shots that deserved it and at the same time meaning it personally as well... but there is only a couple people I do that too and they arent on this site.)

Now, if someone cant handle that then perhaps they need to rethink their reason for posting the image in the first place. Is it because they want a pat on the back or is it because they want an honest opinion from others. If they want a pat on the back I say too bad for them... I really hope that this site will not become that way like so many others have. If they want the truth then they need to bring their thick skin with them when they read the opinions of others. I dont mind hearing that a shot sucks if you tell me why it sucks.

People need to get a grip, words are just words, if you are that insecure then, again, you may need to rethink your reason for posting a shot on a forum that is all about critiques.

All that said... I do try to tell people what I see as lacking in the shot and what I think could improve it. Sometimes though, I dont know why I dont like it and I say that as I did in a post yesterday. And I rarely if ever say the words "that sucks"

Another rant.... I think it is done now.

And if you want to say that a shot of mine sucks then just say it. You arent gonna hurt my feelings or make me stop posting. I respect the truth and I expect it to be brutally honest from your point of view.

Scott